Update progress for AT&T Windows Phones

Update progress for AT&T Windows Phones

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I’m happy to report that two Windows Phones sold by AT&T are a big step closer to getting updates.

The LG Quantum and Samsung Focus are now scheduling both the February update and the March “copy and paste” update. We’ve refreshed Where’s my phone update? to reflect the status changes to these models. We’re now working hard to expedite the delivery of these updates to you.

But we know we still have plenty of work to do. The HTC Surround, for example, won’t be joining the update party just yet. I know that probably comes as a letdown to Surround owners, so let me spend a moment explaining why.

The updates we deliver contain a complex stew of software code. The content often includes not only our fixes and improvements but also software supplied by companies that make the phone itself and the chips inside it. One of these third-party software “packages” earmarked for the HTC Surround needs additional testing by both Microsoft and AT&T. I apologize for the delay. As soon as I have more news, I’ll let you know.

Eric Hautala

GM, Customer Experience Engineering

P.S. I forgot to mention the update we’ll be shipping to AT&T customers also includes support for two special AT&T features. The first is “WISPr” protocol support, which makes it possible for your phone’s data connection to automatically switch over to AT&T Wi-Fi hotspots when in range. The update also includes support for AT&T Address Book.

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  • will people in the Virgin Islands get this update

  • Thanks for the tip on the SD card, I know have 20gb phone!

  • Successful update here, also! I am very excited and optimistic about the WP7 platform, and I hope things get rolling more smoothly very soon. With this update, a few minor annoyances (read: Marketplace!) have been addressed, and I think I can hold out until Mango. But just on the off chance that anyone will see this, a brief wishlist:

    - Bookmarking and Auto-Update Capability in Bing Maps

    Please allow users to "pin" and save locations, and sync them to contacts where appropriate. This has been a minor nuisance, I have to say. Additionally, I feel the technology is already in place to implement a simple auto-update feature when following driving directions. Since the triangulation is capable of pinpointing current location with fair accuracy, I think it would be a great improvement (in the absence of "real" GPS) to add functionality that auto-updates to the STEP in the directions that reflects your current location. For instance, after turning LEFT on Main St., the app should automagically highlight the next instruction: turn RIGHT on 1st St. It may seem minor, but I have felt many times that tapping manually is a bit tiresome.

    - Save Camera Settings

    That is all. Please, save my settings. Two seconds to launch the camera, and then five minutes to reinstate my settings just doesn't make sense.

    - Alphabet Tiles for the Application Screen

    I'm sure this is already in the works, but it bears repeating. Alphabet tile organization/navigation similar to that in the People hub would greatly benefit users with lots of apps.

    There are few more I'm not remembering, but hopefully that's a start. Looking forward to amazing things with this new platform, and the devices that will wield it.

  • bdcam
    1 Posts

    Just updated my Focus with both updates.  No problems!

    Happy days are here again.

    First security update will be sent out soon.

  • OMFG!

    Feb. update .... Installed.

    Nodo..... Installing........  Step 10 of 10... I am so excited........ Done!!!!...   I finally have NODO!

    Now Hurry up and get me some MANGO!   :)

  • @edm @Michael Stroh Maybe MS could post this solution MS Troubleshooting site...  or a link to Xda site :)

  • To all of you AT&T customers who have already updated to NoDo through the approved method: What do you think so far about the WISPr protocol and Address Book added to your WP7?

  • I can confirm that both of my Samsung Focus' have updated to NoDo.  Both a developer phones; where with one I used the Chevron tool to update to NoDo, and the other I did use an alternate hack to apply NoDo prior to the official release.  Both have been updated to the official AT&T Samsung Focus update, including the updated Samsung Focus Firmware, Radio Software, and Bootload updates.  I'm glad this update is finally behind most of us.  I truly hope Microsoft has learned an extremely valuable lesson from this first wave of updates.

    With Mango coming later in the year, I really hope you guys look at splitting it up into smaller updates, so that key features are released in a more timely fashion than what we have all endured with pre-NoDo and NoDo.

  • @Korn1699 - That's the latest version.

  • edm
    27 Posts

    Finally on 7390!

    Samsung Focus, 16GB card

  • Just finished both updates on my AT&T/Samsung Focus without any problems.

  • Korn1699
    114 Posts

    One update finished successfully..  I am at 7390 though.  I thought I read somewhere that the version should be higher after the AT&T updates..  What is the newest version number for the Focus now?

  • edm
    27 Posts

    Found a way around the 801812C1 error:


    I'm on 7008!

  • Krush You
    94 Posts

    If I unlocked my phone to get the nodo update, should I restore it in Zune and get the official At&t one?

  • edm
    27 Posts

    Very dissapointed.  This does not work for me.

    I ran the MS tool issued for error 801812C1 (several times)

    Took the battery off the phone and replaced it.

    Restarted laptop.

    Nothing works.  Same result every time...error 801812C1

    Any suggestions MS?

  • edm
    27 Posts

    @Michael - I already tried that, twice.  The first time the pc had identified my phone as a Zune, then it corrected that, yet it has failed 3 times after that.

  • CoolWP7
    4 Posts

    Prompted to perform the Frebruary update as soon as i plugged in the phone.  Started at 11:36am and it was done by 11:45.  Samsung Focus ATT in CA.

  • edm
    27 Posts

    It stays on step 6 for a while, (I this time I side the Windows 7 message that adriver is being installed), then it goes quickly through the rest of the steps and notifies me of the error.

    I am trying again now.  I took the battery off the phone, then restarted it....let's see....

  • @edm. Here's a link to some troubleshooters for common errors, including the one you're hitting.


  • Korn1699
    114 Posts

    @edm, what step do you get that?

  • edm
    27 Posts

    No luck for me.  I keep getting error 801812C1, even after running the MS tool to fix this problem.

    Anybody at MS can help?

  • Korn1699
    114 Posts

    Actually the update seems to even run on my laptop as a guest device..will update when it fails or succeeds..

  • Korn1699
    114 Posts

    I get the notification that my Focus with NoDo via Chris Walsh's tool has an update.  My linked PC is at home though, so I won't be able to try until then.

  • edm
    27 Posts

    First attempt failed - error 801812C1 (Samsung Focus, 16GB card), fixed that issue ( I think).

    Second attempt in process.....

  • casper7
    14 Posts

    @Bob    thanks for the post!  nothing on my phone but connected to zune and checked and sure enough, updating now!

  • I am recieving both February and March updates for my AT&T LG Quantum.

  • Bob
    9 Posts

    I just checked for the update through Zune and was prompted for a Samsung Update on my ATT-US branded Focus.  I'll be waiting until I get home so I'll have a restore point though.  I did the Zune trick for NODO and didn't get a restore point since my phone is on a guest account on my work PC.  Not this time.  :)

  • mdoan300
    10 Posts

    Thanks for the status update. This is probably the main reason why I hate branded phones. It's just unfortunate that there are no unbranded phones right now that work on AT&T 3G bands.

    P.S., it looks like the masses are demanding more technical explanations and not just the high-level stuff...

  • MalazNJ
    9 Posts

    I want to use really bad words here but I'll do my best to avoid them.

    I have an HTC Surround.

    Are you F******* kiding me?! Over 6 months to wait for a stupid update!

    So, when you say "early 2011" you mean Mid 2011, if everything goes well?!!!!

    Where are the "series of significant updates in few months" you talked about back in 2010?!

    I'm not only angry, I'm furious and feel like breaking everything microsoft. Damn!!!! You cannot deliver one update.

    Even at MIX11 in a couple of weeks ago microsoft said you learned your lessons and you are getting better at delivering these updates!!!

    When the hell am I going to get the Mango update then???? In 2014?????

    And I thought this WP7 will be better than WM platforms??? I'll be lucky if I get one update in the timeframe I owned a device!!

  • casper7
    14 Posts

    i too am impatiently waiting for the update for my focus.  my wife has the surround and may trade it for the iphone.  so if the update does good for my phone she might keep hers and wait before trading it in.  so let us know if any one happens to get their update.  i know i will.

  • I am glad to see that things are progressing but...

    Honestly I'm not consoled by the notion of having to wait for updates on account of a third-party (bloat-ware?). I can certainly see the need for hardware specific testing, but waiting for At&t apps proves unacceptable. Is there any reason why the At&t updates can't be separate? Other than us having to be forced to install them?

    I really wish updates could be streamlined as in the case of iOS, but then again, I guess only Apple lives in a perfect world. This presents the need for Windows featured hardware build hardware. Then they could assert control much like Apples does. We could get a 'pure' installation directly from them.

    Until then, I guess we are stuck with things as they are. Hopefully they will get better. I really don't want to have to go through this again w/ Mango.

  • @ScubaDog - I, too, am hoping for a quick delivery of the updates. While I do hope the rumors are true (about the updates being pushed today), they are just that - rumors. I'm not holding the WP7 team accountable for missing a date that was never officially stated. But again, I do hope we receive the updates soon!

  • ScubaDog
    141 Posts

    Well, it's 19 April.  So far, it seems anti-climactic.  None of my friends who chose to wait on AT&T have received any notification the update is available.  <sigh>

  • MWA1955
    4 Posts

    PLEASE!!! I do not want the WISPr on my phone. It has significant security issues! The last thing I want is for my phone's WIFI to switch to an open and unsecure network that I don't know about. This is so STUPID! Oh, BTW, the address book thing -- very lame. Try Live Mail.. MUCH BETTER! I'm amazed that AT&T lets that through. Bing Navigator is not available because AT&T wants to force people to buy their $10/ mo AT&T Navaigator app! That too is lame.

  • GBK
    38 Posts

    this platform isn't dead. stop saying it.. BUT it doesn't help that MS just doesn't seem to get it or care that they are pissing off the majority of early adopters but letting the carriers ruin the experience for majority of the customers with stupid bloated included crap that delays availability.  ATT wants wispr or whatever make a freaking APP or INDEPENDENT update and stop messing with the OS. Personally I don't care about their Wi-Fi hotspots.. there isn't any near where I use my phone and ATT little address book is completely pointless on Windows Phone.  

    Why would you keep addresses there?? when you have live.. and when you switch carriers your addresses go with you instead of stay with ATT?

  • edm
    27 Posts

    So, it is the 19th.....when/if I get the update I'll post it.

    Please do the same if any of you get it.

  • Nice updates, keep them coming!!..


  • Ok so i have been wanting copy paste for a while now. I have been using forward a lot to get my words to something else, or if i have to retweet something. Now that im going to get it im happy. Thanks, 5 STARS. Im hoping mango goes smoother than this one did.

  • Sorry for the typos: writers with that same type of talk***

  • @Captiosus - I'm not saying i disagree with most of that writers points as they're basically the same ones people here been pointing out all along but the whole "Dead in the water... abandon ship" i don't agree with. When the first Xbox came out there was plenty of writers that same type of talk and then with the 360's RROD issues many also said it was "Dead in the water" after that hardware issue.

    I'm all for hoping Microsoft speeds things up with their updates and Marketplace growth but it hasn't even been out for a full year yet to write it off.

  • Krush You
    94 Posts

    @ThaRebeliouZ -

    3. the data issue affected iphone users as well and was found to NOT be a windows phone issue

    4. there is now officially supported sd cards for window s phones

    5. we don't know what is going to happen with the next update, for all we know the carriers will have less control. its one update, no one was perfect their first outing

    The others I agree with but "dead in the water" - I don't think you can really call it when the platform is barely 6 months old

  • Captiosus
    103 Posts

    @ThaRebeliouZ - I can't really argue with the points presented in the blog you linked.

    It IS sad that many tech bloggers have been saying the platform is dead, or wants it to die (you'd think they'd embrace competition), but all of his points in that blog are, sadly, valid and verifiable. His point #3 borders on opinion, but the "data leakage" issue can be found in many blogs and carrier forums.

  • Captiosus
    103 Posts

    @a688 - Your list of answers were hilarious. I mean that with all sincerity. Sounds like you have a firm grasp on PR already! #2 and #5 are the best, and lives up to the old adage of "If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bull....".

    I'd damn well like some answers. As I posted on the AT&T Facebook page about this, assuming we see Mango, will we even be able to update to it without having to go through the same homebrew hoops because AT&T now has their OWN iteration of NoDo for their phones while the rest of the known world is using plain old 7390? Or will Mango add WISPr to all phones just to bring them up to the same base OS iteration? Or will AT&T require yet MORE tweaks to the core OS before Mango can go out to AT&T users?

    Too many questions, AT&T's hands too far into the core OS.

    Screw WISPr. The genie is out of the bottle. By letting AT&T get away with this rather than putting WISPr as part of NoDo that went to EVERYONE, carriers are going point to AT&T getting special treatment to try to get more into the core OS and fragment the platform just as they did with Android. Just what MS was trying to PREVENT that from happening.

  • www.i4u.com/.../6-reasons-windows-phone-7-dead-water - 6 Reasons Windows Phone 7 is Dead in the Water

    Bloggers and so called "Tech Experts" really want this platform to die already, smh.

  • hg23
    5 Posts

    This is exactly why updates need to be split up.  Why does it make sense to roll all these special features into the 1 update that MS is releasing to all WP7 users?  Just put out the update and then send out the carrier and OEM specific stuff later.  

    To me, it's like holding up the President's flight because the pilot's brother wants to tag along and is running late...

  • WP 7
    7 Posts

    Where we can expect Polish language? I know that it was mentioned sth about cunries from the east but it is not enough for me :)



  • a688
    27 Posts


    I understand what you are saying but the point I was trying (and perhaps failed) to make was that the WP7 team continues to have terrible communication with their customers. Their communication is definitely better than it used to be, but better doesn't mean good. Having your dog poop in your shoes every other morning is better than having it done every morning, but its not good (unless you are into that sort of thing). However, the WP7 team continues to disappoint us with clearly opaque, non-helpful, PR laden excuses and blog posts. It seems that every time you turn around something else the WP7 team tells us becomes a half-truth at best, a lie at worst. Eric's own update on March 30th clearly states that they will refresh the update page every wednesday (at time unknown). This wednesday (unless the updated the page pretty late in the day in CST land) they didn't even update the date on the page. I'm actually GLAD they (finally) updated the page on Friday but at the same time they managed to go against their own word yet again. If they want us to trust them then they have to actually follow through on their word and not make different promises for issues. Are they going to update that web page every wednesday or are they going to updated it whenever a status changes? I have no idea because they said one thing and then did another.

    Instead of throwing in dumb lines like "complex stew of software code" like we are kids, I'd rather Eric had spent an extra 5 minutes on this blog post and expanded on things like:

    1) Why are they purposely fragmenting their user base by making WISPr support part of the march update for ATT (only?).  And yes it IS fragmentation, person A's phone will operate differently from person B's phone.

    2) What they are going to do about the differences between ATT's image and everybody else's?

    3) If WISPr is so great why didn't they include it in NoDo for everybody?

    4) Why didn't they make WISPr support a seperate/optional update? Will this be a seperate update for others/not available at all/forced to wait until mango/never available to anyone else, f' off users?

    5) Should we expect more crap like this from WP7/ATT in the future?

    Unfortunately I have a feeling I know the "answer" to all of these questions already:

    1) It isn't fragmentation, ATT is our PREMIERE carrier so we give them extra stuff that the others don't get.

    2) There are no differences. Everybody has the same base image except for the carriers that don't.

    3) WISPr IS sliced bread.

    4) Our customers enjoy waiting for months on end to get bug fixes to avoid the annoyance of an occasional update

    5) Look over there, puppies.

  • To be totally honest, I wouldn't have an issue with AT&T injecting their software if I had the option of either NOT INSTALLING or REMOVING it.  Just don't FORCE me to keep it on MY phone.

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts


    I'm all for criticizing, but let's be fair a bit here.  They didn't lie about Wednesday updates. They did update us on Wednesday that nothing had changed, so this is more of a bonus update. I'm glad they didn't wait until Wednesday to announce this.


  • You should also consider if the delays/blocking of these updates was bad this time around please keep in mind that we are all using current generation devices, you really think carriers will actually bother testing these updates when our phones become previous generation?  If you do then you are seriously mistaken, because those carriers will want a reason for us to renew our contracts and pay for yet another brand new current generation phone.  Carriers don't like software updates, they bite into their profits and prevent customers being tied to contracts which means higher risk of losing them to a competitor (higher churn rates) when they finally do upgrade.

  • So what now, you all jump around celebrating, patting yourselves on the back for a job well done? Didn't we do well, disaster averted, we turned this thing around.  This is getting beyond a joke because, in case you had forgotten, Windows Phones are available internationally or did you think we were dealing with Zune?

    So far it seems that the US market is all that matters and I don't recall one mention of international customers in all these so called updates that you have been posting.  What about people like myself still waiting on Deutsche Telekom to release both the February AND March updates?  Seriously sit up and wake up because despite all your clever dancing around the subject carriers ARE BLOCKING WINDOWS PHONE UPDATES!

    Don't worry, I realise you don't give a _____ about us international customers.

  • gbneely
    2 Posts

    That is a much better update. It is actually detailed and gives reasoning for any dalays. I think MS is getting the picture. I do like my phone and am looking forward to the updates.

  • @BuckeyeTico - Eric can't understand the words we speak if he never reads the comments to his posts.  It's hard to hear your users when you obviously make it a point to ignore them.

    I've decided that I'm going to Chevron my Surround tonight.  This decision is not only because we have to continue waiting for the update.  I've also chosen this path because I don't want AT&T's crap on my phone.  When you purchased your AT&T WP7 phone, what were the first things to get removed?  That's right...all of the pre-installed AT&T crap on it.  Why in the HELL would I want MORE on it?  NO THANKS!!!

    This carrier-specific software brewed into the OS is a blatant violation of the initial premise of WP7...NO FRAGMENTATION.  Micro$4!T has given into AT&T yet again and WP7 will follow the same path as Windows Mobile.

    I've begun writing a letter to Steve Balmer asking that Eric Hautala be replace in his current role.  He obviously has no clue how to do his job and now there's an incensed user base because of it.  This is absolutely ridiculous.

  • dkb1898
    167 Posts

    WISPr - What I find most amusing about this, and the worthless AT&T Contacts (Isn't that what Windows Live is for?) is that it's not even an approved standard!!! It's basically putting a very unproven protocol on our devices, let's hope there is a way to DISABLE it because it's untested security wise.

  • @ Eric Hautala - You wrote: "I’m happy to report that two Windows Phones sold by AT&T are a big step closer to getting updates." A big step closer? You don't get it, do you? We want -and you owe us, specific dates!!! DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE WORDS THAT ARE COMING OUT OF OUR MOUTHS? Is this guy for real?

  • jalf
    8 Posts

    What does this "explanation" actually explain?

    *Why* do WP7 phones require such absurd amounts of testing, when no other platform apparently does.

    You've already said a dozen times that this and that requires testing. That's not new. But I'm still baffled as to why you've spent the last 4-5 months testing a small update of the kind that Apple is out to roll out on a monthly basis.

    Why the huge discrepancy in the amount of testing that is needed?

    And will future updates need less testing? And why?

    You said you'd explain why some phones won't get updated yet. So give us the explanation. What is it with this testing that takes such an absurd amount of time? Who screwed up, and will their screwup affect future updates as well? If Microsoft screwed up, what does it mean for the platform going forward. If someone else screwed up, what is Microsoft going to do to keep them from sinking the platform the *next* time they screw up?

  • Yippee! Also great with the clear communication with the issues with updating the phones. I hope that this transparancy remains going forward. Without www.taniechanel.com/kupowac-replika-chanel.html this communication, it appears that carriers are blocking the updates to require us to purchase even more products and services from them. Thank you for making the best phone one the planet.

  • a688
    27 Posts

    By the fact that only ATT gets this magical WISPr protocol support that tells me that it is completely worthless. If it wasn't worthless you would have made it available to all phones (notice I didn't say to all providers/ISPs/worthless wireless companies). Also the ATT update includes access to the ATT address book, wooo what another worthless addition. I'm glad I updated my "ATT" focus to NoDo using one of the unauthorized methods instead of getting MORE worthless ATT crap on my phone.

    The WP7 team and ATT have successfully changed the meaning of the term premiere from first/best to last/worthless. Also, what happened to only updating the "Where's my phone update?" page only on Wednesday? Let me quote you, Eric, from your update on 2011.03.30: "You can see the list at Where’s my phone update?, which we’ll be refreshing on Wednesdays with the latest schedule changes". It looks like you updated the "Where's my phone update?" page on Friday, not Wednesday. The lies from the WP7 team continue, but its not like you truly cared about not lying to us anyways. Why don't you drop the BS about updating on Wednesdays and update the web page when things change?

    Why was WISPr support so top secret that you couldn't tell us until now? Why is ATT phone book support so important that you included it with NoDo instead of making it a separate release? Why are you tying carrier specific crap with important OS updates? Why can't you tell us the truth instead of giving us blog posts covered in 5 layers of PR BS?

    PS: WTF does "scheduling" take up to 10 days? Are you guys so f'n retarded that after the first carrier update you completely forget how to do things? Why can't you simply start rolling out the update to customers after testing is finished? Why can't you plan ahead, like during testing, to figure out how to send out updates? Oh yeah, that's right, you're the WP7 team where thinking about your customers (the people who BUY the end product) is the last thing you do.

  • Or how about this as an idea.

    You release the firmware updates that individual providers give you as a seperate update!

    Rocket science :)

  • @Captiosus - I agree about the AT&T BLOATWARE comment. The only AT&T App i have on my Quantum is the "MyWireless", everything else sucked and was quickly uninstalled.

    As for the WP7 Commercials, im actually seeing a few lately specially during the NBA Playoffs. But they definitely need more aggressive Ads. Also right there with you on the debranding my Quantum to get "Mango" if we gotta deal with this lame update carrier waiting list again.

  • Telstra? Optus?

    How exactly did you get your job as CUSTOMER experience engineering. Because you really do suck at it.

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts


    Don't get me wrong, as a Surround owner, this delay stings and stings hard.  But just because AT&T is the only group supporting WISPr doesn't mean they didn't just put support in there on all the phones.  In which case there'd be no fragmentation.

    The real fragmentation is happening because AT&T is dragging their feet which MS isn't holding to the fire.  Oh and apparently some "3rd party package" and since HTC is the only 3rd party I see in this shuffle it must be something from them.  Although my guess is the "package" in the HD7 (which passed), so AT&T and MS aren't testing fast enough.

  • seo
    2 Posts

    Today I went back to my Android. My WP will have a looong rest now. NoDo is just not good enough. Still unexpected reboots and no norwegian keyboard until Mango!! Im tired of all this nonsense. Goodbye WP.

  • Captiosus
    103 Posts

    @tsrblke - Right. WISPr is a protocol and isn't unique to AT&T  except for the fact that AT&T is the only provider that actually uses it. Protocols have to be allowed and maintained in the core OS networking configuration. Ergo, by putting WISPr protocol available only on AT&T phones, Microsoft is allowing AT&T to dictate changes to CORE OS FUNCTIONS.

    As Michael Ball posted, it's Android all over again because now AT&T users are going to have a version of NoDo that no other WP7 device has. Microsoft SPECIFICALLY stated back in October-November 2010 that this was NOT going to be the case. The only differences in the OS were going to be at the OEM/hardware level, and even THAT had mandatory minimum requirements so all devices would have a minimum base.

  • Captiosus
    103 Posts

    Also, this "news" still really isn't news.

    Per your own chart, Scheduling can take up to 10 business days. Since this post was made on a Sunday, 10 business days goes anywhere from 4/18 to 4/29. Afterward, delivering, also per your own chart, can take "several weeks". It can be anywhere from the end of April to the end of May before the update is actually "delivered" to customers. And many world customers who were supposed to see these updates before us still haven't seen them?

    Will Mango go smoother? Probably, but whether it goes smoother or not doesn't matter when Mango is 8 MONTHS away. Major iteration updates at one- or two-per-year is inexcusable. By the time it comes out, you're still going to be years behind iOS 5 and Android 3.3.

    Here. I found this. It's the ball you dropped. At this point, I have a gut feeling Microsoft's Windows Phone strategy is to string along WP7 until they can push out W8 which they're already promoting as being great for cross-platform functionality with AppX and ARM support, then try to push us all to W8.

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @Captiosus WISPr is actually a protocol though, so I'm not entirely sure that this is unique to AT&T other than they're the only one's maintaining the large wireless network.

    the Address book is a load of crap.  A huge load.  My contacts already get ported to my Live account, as the phone was designed to do (and why I liked it.)  Why are we adding some 3rd party stuff?

  • Captiosus
    103 Posts

    @cmwind - "marketing, marketing, marketing, marketing! speed, speed, speed! look at the IE team. they are finally becoming competitive."

    I find this part of your comment particularly relevant in light of the article I read in the recent GameInformer magazine. They were discussing why Kinect sole 8 million units in 60 days while Sony, literally this month, just sold their 8 millionth Move wand controller, despite the fact that neither system has stellar software available. The answer was simple, and this is how GI put it in their magazine: "One of them was aggressively marketed, the other squeaked out like a fart in the wind. Guess which one was which."

    Every time I see an ad for a cellphone, it's either Android or iPhone. I haven't seen a WP7 ad in a month - the "phone to save us from our phones" ad campaign has dried up and all the carrier WP7 ads have died. The last WP7 ad I saw was way back in mid-March, and it was the Samsung Focus ad.

    WP7 squeaked out like a fart in the wind. Every OEM that manufactures WP7 phones are aggressively marketing their Android phones (HTC being the most notable). Every carrier is aggressively marketing Android and iOS. WP7 displays are shoved in the back corner at T-Mobile stores and AT&T stores. The only press WP7 has been getting has been NEGATIVE press. The old adage of any publicity is good publicity doesn't apply to devices trying to compete in a tech market.


    @Eric - Special AT&T features? That was the hold up? What a crock - What happened to the "carriers aren't going to be able to modify the core os"? Adding a WiFi switching function specifically for sure sounds like a modification of the core OS to me. So not only have you caved into the carriers and allowed them to control the update process, you've caved again and are allowing AT&T to add core-level BLOATWARE to the OS itself...

    Glad I updated my Quantum through debranding. If I have to, I'll get Mango the same way, too. I don't want either of that AT&T garbage on my phone, and, frankly, I'm very pissed that updates were delayed so AT&T could wrangle you into doing their bidding.

    2 Posts

    Windows phone sucks big ones u cant even have custom ring tones and u have to d/l zune which sucks all its own

  • "I know that probably comes as a letdown to Surround owners"

    What do you mean, "probably"?

    @Eric - You're a joke.  I can't stop laughing at how bad you are.

  • cmwind
    71 Posts

    i'm just going to keep saying this. if y'all move as fast as you did with the zune, then windows phone will be another zune. marketing, marketing, marketing, marketing! speed, speed, speed! look at the IE team. they are finally becoming competitive. and its because they are speeding up. if windows phone fails, y'all are in trouble. while i do in fact want the mango update i am not interseted in y'all speeding up for my personal gain. i want y'all to speed up for your own success. i know software development is not "magical" but y'all are the largest software company in the world and i just don't understand how you can be so absurdley slow. please! please! please! i'm begging you to speed up.

  • I think 50% general public smartphone users don't do any update after they buy the phone. Still it's not done well. WP7 should announce country specific schedule / like iPhone model 1day update to all and stick to it in future. This carrier wise update is total crap. In india we've 10 different carriers / state, how MS is going to manage this I'm not sure.

  • The added AT&T software completely violates the premise of WP7 in the first place...remove fragmentation of the OS.  Guess what!  That's exactly what's happening again.  AT&T customer now have a "one off" from the rest of the world.  Again, another reason to get rid of my WP7 and AT&T.

  • Bob
    9 Posts

    Oh man, this AT&T garbage software better be uninstallable.  I don't want your stinking custom software/apps on my phone.  That's another reason I chose WP7 and not Android, provider software was uninstallable.  Make an app and let the customers decide if they want to use it.  Judging by the ratings of AT&Ts other apps, my guess would be nobody would use them.

  • zhaklak
    3 Posts

    just wondering what could be the engineering reasons for scheduling to take 10 business days!?..

  • ScubaDog
    141 Posts

    Hah!  I NAILED it.  I just knew that AT&T was holding the update back because of their garbage unique software.  I've said it before and I'll say it again, I do NOT want software from a carrier.  I don't want the carrier to do SQUAT to my devices.  Just give me a good, fast connection at a reasonable price.  That's it.  That's all I need.  I expect the OEM and Microsoft to provide the device and software I need.  WISPr.  What a waste of memory.  AT&T address book?  PLEASE, I have the cloud, for pity's sake.

  • xchamox
    17 Posts

    Eric, you finally did it! You explained what the hold up was and actually gave details instead of PR nonsense this time! I got my NoDo update on my HD7 a while back, but I'm sure that the AT&T and HTC Surround users will be pleased with this post. People are always much more willing to be patient when they know why they're waiting.

  • grnbd
    7 Posts

    @ian.aldrighetti  - Once again it does not matter if it was listed as rumor or not.

    Your right it's not MS fault if some AT&T or MS employee lets a memo leak.

    You know what their fault is, saying nothing while the rumors and bad press spread.

    Even worse posting here with vague statements, corporate spin, and excuses not explanations.

    Tech bloggers gave us better info, because MS said nothing with any real meaning.

    The silence got so bad that some users felt forced to use a work around. Hell it might as well have been an Android device.

    Like I said before MS management and PR in this situation was a disappointment and harmed WP7 momentum, but I am also confident that they have learned from this and Mango will go smoother.

  • February Update = May release for Surround owners which, by the way, had NO issues during the first release attempt.  It was the FOCUS that had the issues.  I guess this is the "squeeky wheel" syndrom again.

    At this point, I've given up.  This will be both my LAST WP7 phone and my last contract with AT&T for whom my wife works.  I'm sick fo both companies and their crap.  This is ridiculous!!!  At least with my iPhone everything was handled by one company and release across the board at the same time.  I guess there's something to be said about Apple's business model.  We own it.  We update it.  Get out of our way.  I wish Microsoft would have taken that approach.  Unfortunately for them and AT&T, they didn't and I won't be back.

  • piaqt
    13 Posts

    Yeah, yeah. Long-term solution: Legislation / antitrust lawsuit to sever the carriers from device sales, thereby removing their economic incentive prevent updates to existing phones. It worked on the film studios, who had to sell the theaters, and on Ma Bell, who had to split up into regional carriers and support non-AT&T phones.

    Short-term: MSFT does all the testing and update delivery, and carriers (that's you, AT&T) be hanged.

  • techieg
    25 Posts

    when will Windows Live IM/presence (integration in the People hub) and Bing voice-enabled navigation coming to WP7? These are MS technologies that one would think will be first-class citizens to get on WP7 but we are all still begging for them yet while thrid-party technologies are getting better treatment on WP7.

  • Krush You
    94 Posts

    @grnbd - fanboy? No, I just can accept the "hey, we messed up and we are new to be this open, so bare with us", now if this is the continuing pattern I'll bring my torch and pitchfork to the next lynching.

  • money.cnn.com/.../mobile_mango_update_windows_phone_7_timing.html - Windows Phone 7 Plans for 2011: Catch Up to 2009

    "There just aren’t enough things that Windows Phone 7 devices do well enough to make them appealing to a wide audience If there are, Microsoft is holding back super sales numbers for reasons I can’t fathom. All I want to see is Microsoft better-level the smartphone playing field by picking up the pace in making a good mobile platform even better."

  • rlintw
    13 Posts

    Eric, thanks for the continuing series of updates. This is really helpful and while some folks seem impressed that tech blogs had these announcements first, they forget many of the same blogs have had a variety of posts that were just plain wrong. It is important to keep supporters informed officially and since you've come on board, there has been marked improvement. It was also a good idea to provide details about the added AT&T functionality that people had read about because I've already read a raging debate about what that meant on one of those tech blogs. And every single one of the ideas offered in that debate was incorrect based on your update about the AT&T features.

    There is still a ways to go for this first update, but I hope you are thinking of providing regular communication to users in the months between the final days of the NoDo update and when Mango launches. Please don't go all "radio silence" on us in between. Tell us how you've changed processes based on the NoDo experience, tell us more about how the whole testing process works, leak a detail or two about Mango, just keep talking.

  • @grnbd

    Once again... Microsoft and AT&T cannot always keep their employees from leaking information. It is not Microsoft's fault that some AT&T employee leaked a memo when they weren't supposed to.

    As, already stated, the posts you saw about the AT&T update coming to Windows Phone users were still rumors, because they only had "anonymous sources." They could have been bogus for all you know. This post does have a purpose to even those who saw this elsewhere: validation. Without this post everything about the AT&T update coming soon (some say April 19... Guess what? No specific date was given, meaning it is a RUMOR, see how that works?) would still be merely heresay, now it is not.

  • grnbd
    7 Posts

    @Krush You - So what if it was listed as rumor or not. Simple fact is I have gotten better status updates on the NoDo update from tech bloggers than from MS.

    I am a loyal MS user who is very ticked off and disappointed at the level of communication and support from MS and expect much better from them.

    It does not matter if the OS is 5 months old or 5 years old. MS is a company that in the past has seen the mistakes others have made and capitalizes on them. It's one of the reasons they rule the desktop with Windows and Office.

    They have seen the mistakes of Apple and Android and instead of avoiding them they are repeating them.

    I am a loyal MS user, who is confident things will improve for the Mango update, but that does not mean I will not call them on the mistakes they make.

    You however sound like a fanboy who is willing to forgive every stupid thing they do. Like Apple fan boys who forgive Apple every time one of their updates breaks the Alarm app, or the fact they are at a 4th gen device and the phone still has nagging reception problems.

  • Retsud
    7 Posts

    "Any word on T-Mobile / Deutsche Telekom will we get the NoDo update this Year ?"

    LOL - Way to go! I asked this repeatedly on Erics last blog entries - don't expect an answer.

  • ibmckay
    8 Posts

    Eric - Thank you for the update. At last, finally, I will be able to update my phones! I was starting to wonder if that day would ever come. I ask only one favor (favour). Please make sure that whatever you learned from this mess, that it won't repeat itself again, especially when it comes to the Mango update. NoDo is one thing, but it would be a terrible pill to swallow during the Mango update, to know that the same phones on both sides of the oceans are left waiting once again.

    As you are probably now aware, many of us couldn't wait to get our new phones when they first hit the market, even when we knew that some of the common functionality was missing. We banked on your promise to provide timely updates, believing that at long last, it was safe to drink Microsoft's Kool-Aid again. You surely tested our faith. Now that this issue is nearly resolved, please finish the process for the remaining phones, and make sure you deliver the next update in a more timely fashion.

  • Fantastic news, Eric! Also, this is exactly the type of concrete details we would like to get for future updates. Definitely gives us more insight in regards to the challenges your team encounters while rolling out the updates. When we have such clear information, we feel like we're on the same team, and it also allows us to be more patient and understanding.

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @Krush You

    Fair enough, my point remains, the Focus made it through testing fast than the surround, which prior to now we hadn't heard any problems with.  "Testing" is proving to be a nebulous phase where any phone can get trapped delaying important upgrades indefinitely.

  • Krush You
    94 Posts


    It didn't brick, if any did it was a very miniscule amount - a battery pulled fixed it and if for whatever reason it did brick the carrier or manufacturer was replacing them

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    I now kinda regret getting a surround.  It was a prize so I didn't really have a choice I suppose.

    I'm a bit confused though, the update bricked some Focus's and yet they still made it through testing first?  I suppose this is the intrinsic problem, the "testing" phase makes entirely no sense. Specifically what 3rd party "package" is holding us up and why can't it just be pushed into a different update?  What more testing needs to be done?

    We'll be looking at the tail end of May before I see my update.  My hopes are not strong that I'll even see Mango before my phone craps out due to age.

    Let's by clear, by and large I love my windows phone, and I own a Zune.  But MS builds things for the long haul, with tons of post-release suppose, that's why I enjoy their products, if the post-release suppose never makes it to me then part of the reason I got a windows phone in the first place is moot.

  • Krush You
    94 Posts

    @mike2k that makes no sense whatsoever...they are delivering updates to improve performance how is that mean "they're crippling our phones?"

  • Krush You
    94 Posts

    @grnbd - you realize those sites had it listed as rumor, right? No matter what company out in the business world who has  updates, features, new products coming out they hit the blogs before the official source...tv, movies, video games are the same way all because of the Internet. Eric validated the blogs therefore it's now official and no longer rumor

  • Krush You
    94 Posts

    @stocist- seriously it's the first update...yes it sucks but ms has forgotten about us?  It may not be the feedback you want but at least they are trying and I am sure they are learning from this to make the next updates smoother. Its still better then the way android does. Their first gen devices were lucky to get any update at all...the original droid support was dropped on that after 9 months and was their most popular phone

    We are not in may that's 2 weeks away...

  • Razor
    53 Posts

    I'm so glad I'm not on AT&T... or have the "wrong" phone... or in any other way got screwed by circumstance and was unable to update my Focus =P I feel pretty bad for people who *may* get this march update in May or June =\

  • Don't forget about Optus Australia! We are still waiting...

  • KR
    503 Posts

    So sorry for AT&T Customers,we're already in May,still talking about February update.haha,you guys will probably get Mango in 2014 that is if it will even be made available for you and assuming it will be released this fall and the other devices get it in 2012.

    I'll highly recommend you sell your WP7 phones for the best offer u receive.Microsoft has forgotten about its early adopters,us.all the talk about are the new upcoming devices with WP7 Series.

    @Eric.I think you better shut up till when you have precise and concise details about solutions to our complaints because you are really annoying.we are not in politics,keep you promises for yourself and Microsoft as a whole.we need actions and doers not thinkers and crooks.

  • ammughal
    25 Posts

    Any word on T-Mobile / Deutsche Telekom will we get the NoDo update this Year ?

  • grnbd
    7 Posts

    A little late to the party Eric.

    I read this on pcoketnow.com a few hours ago.

    Like I said in a an earlier post, it's sad when I get better info from a tech blogger then from the GM of Customer Experience.

    I'm happy for the update, but that does not let you or MS off the hook for the complete lack of clear communication, and the total lack of management during this entire painful process.

    You owe the early adopters who will also be your most loyal users allot more respect than what we've been shown so far.

    MS really let us all down on this one.

    I hope you actually read all of the comments and take them seriously and learn from them.

    I fully expect the Mango update to go smoother, and I have confidence it will, but if it does not I also expect clear communication, clear timetables, clear explanations not excuses or corporate spin.

    I also hope you learn something in your dealings with phone manufacturers and carriers. Pointing fingers at each other does not help. Take responsibility for the mistakes and fix them. You can point fingers later behind boardroom doors. Don't let it affect your customers.

    It not just about getting the job done, it's about getting the job done right.