Updates: A quick check in

Updates: A quick check in

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Hi everyone.  No news about updates this week. But I wanted to let you know that I’m reading your comments about the handful of phones still in testing and understand your concern.  As we note on Where’s My Phone Update?, the testing phase—mobile operator network and quality tests—can vary in scope and length. We’re intent on delivering remaining Windows Phone 7.5 updates as soon as we’re able and have already made focused preparations for doing just that. I wanted you to know we haven’t forgotten and are doing everything we can to speed things along. The moment there’s news, I’ll let you know.

Eric Hautala, General Manager, Customer Experience Engineering

139 Comments
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  • It looks like my Samsung Focus S will be going back to at&t on Monday.  I’ve been carrying two mobile phones for a couple of years now; a company cell phone since who knows when and the more recently my office landline number ported to a cell phone.  My “office” phone is an iPhone 4 and the “cell” had been an at&t (HTC) Tilt 2.  The Tilt 2 was the far better option given frequent travel abroad because I could better control the frequent attachments I get in my email.  I held off on replacing the Windows phone until first-release issues were resolved and when I was comfortable that they had and when it appeared we wouldn’t be seeing a Nokia in the US near term, I ordered a Focus S as soon as they were made available through our at&t business account.  I love the phone and IMHO feel the Metro UI smokes iOS (and Android by extension).  I miss my RoboForm app at the moment as well as a couple of others, notably United Airlines and WorldMate.  However, I can get by until they’re made available on this platform.  But, and this is a big but, I must have the ability to reply to email and include the previous message(s).  We’re on Exchange 2003 with plans to migrate to 2010 sometime in the future (I can assure you that they won’t be rolling it out sooner just to accommodate me and my Windows Phone).  And while I “hear” that they’re addressing this and might have a release out there somewhere soon, I have to get the phone back within the thirty-day period or risk getting caught in something like this Focus 1.4 horror story.  And almost as important, it is incredulous that you cannot edit downloaded Excel files in Office Mobile.  I have a number of spreadsheets stored in the cloud that I might need to access when traveling and the fact that I cannot edit them is unforgivable.  On a recent trip – domestic so both the iPhone and the Focus S were handy – I got a call while boarding a flight with a request for an update on one of these spreadsheets.  No problem, grabbed the file from DropBox and it came right up – unfortunately I couldn’t do anything with it.  The work-around was to bring it up in Documents-to-Go on the iPhone where I could do the edit and then emailed it on.  Interestingly the active cell in the file opened in Documents-to-Go was exactly the same as it was as last saved.  Office Mobile had me in A1.  Inexcusable.  Considered going back to Blackberry (9900) but think I’ll put the SIM back in the Tilt and cross my fingers that things will be as they should when we start seeing the Nokia’s – maybe a Lumia 900.

    PS.  Stopped in an at&t store yesterday to look at the new Blackberries and I concur with many of the other posters here – they are clueless, absolutely clueless on the Windows phones.

  • Hi guys, I have been coming here checking for update information for some time waiting and waiting and waiting for my update. I not only waited a very long time for the Mango update but am one of the unlucky few who have a focus 1.4

    Those of you here waiting for this I am sure are as amazed as i am that this is actually still an issue for what was at launch - the flagship Windows Phone. Well if you feel as taken for a ride as I do, complaining and questioning will do nothing, you have to vote with your dollars. If Microsoft takes a look at the numbers and sees that 65% of users with a windows phone upgraded to another windows phone and 90% of users with a focus 1.4 switched to another OS at renewal time, they will fix the issue because the issue cost them money. If we make sure that we post and blog about the lack of reliability from windows in delivering a consistent customer experience to all of their few users, they will change because it costs them bad press. If we just buy another phone and blindly hope it doesn't happen again...... it will. Vote with your dollars and place as many reviews about your experience as possible and once it has cost Microsoft enough money, maybe they will get it together in time for us to all enjoy Windows 8 without wishing we had an iphone.

  • What I would like in the Calendar app is a relative date repeat function (i.e. the 3rd Tuesday of every month) which I loved on my Blackberry. I would also like to be able to have a scrolling reminder time where we can choose exactly how long of a reminder we need. If this is not possible at least add in a 90 minute reminder choice. I hate how it goes from 1 hour to 18 hours.

  • I know for certain my next phone won't be a Samsung, whatever the OS will be. This, coupled with continued issues with my phone has just turned me off on their products or phones at least.

  • geogeek
    7 Posts

    I've talked to AT&T and Samsung about this problem. AT&T at least tried to help me, but in the end they just gave me Samsung's and Microsoft's phone numbers. No news. The guy at Samsung was a jerk. No replacement phone, no updating of the phone, no news as to whose court the ball was in, and when asked if I was stuck with this lemon phone; his answer was "yes". Not much of a confidence builder in their product.

  • leifage
    13 Posts

    I have a Samsung Omnia 7. I got "Mango", think it was late september, by doing the trick and disconnect internetconnection while Zune was checking for updates. And just now I got an update from Samsung. Only thing I see has changed, is that internetsharing is now available. By the way, I'm in Norway and running on english OS. It seems i will not get a Norwegian OS. This OS really rocks, and I'm eagerly waiting for Nokia Lumia 800 to arrive stores in Norway...I'm ditching the Samsung right away. The Samsung has worked, would say perfectly, but the Nokia seemes very interesting. And please, make it possible to do screenshots, the calender should have the possibility to show weeknumbers, and it should be a native solution for sharing contacts. Come'on, we are almost in year 2012, ...shouldnt be necessary to run 3. party apps to be able to those things. And none of the apps I have tried for forwarding contacts to others have worked very well. But as mentioned earlier...internetsharing is working on my unbranded Omnia 7.

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    I have a 1.3, and I'm fairly well versed on the subject. AT&T just staffs horribly ill informed customer care agents.  It's all about getting people off the phone as fast as possible. Satisfaction be damned.  Saying "It won't be updated, period, it's a dead phone" ends the line of questions "When? Can you garuntee that? Will I be told if there's a delay." even if it upsets you.

  • Zerofun
    13 Posts

    @ tsrblke  

    yeah your probably right... have any of you guys even called and asked someone about the 1.4 issues.. its sad how little they all know about it...

    I guess considering the size of AT&T's customer base.. and the fact that we are all in the minority with this issue.. its not that surprising. I mean how many of us would be so educated on this topic if we had an iPhone, or even revision  1.3 of the focus..

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @Zerofun

    I highly doubt that's true, I've had AT&T support tell me a lot of stupid things before (including "The Focus S can't get mango" really? It comes with Mango!)

    (The December party may--emphasis on MAY--be true, but only because we're only 15 days from december.)

  • Zerofun
    13 Posts

    "just got off the phone with ATT cancelling my account with them, their support team said that the 1.4 is a dead phone and is phased out of their lineup. They said that if any update is going to be coming to it, it won't be until late December and maybe even February of next year.

    Everybody should be ****** about this and calling into support to try get get a replaced phone. If you are still within warranty period, then call in and get a replacement for the $HITTY product you were sold"

    Source:

    windowsphone.uservoice.com/.../2377028-where-is-mango-samsung-for-focus-1-4

    This isn't true is it ? If it is i need to make some phone calls right now.

  • JimmiV
    2 Posts

    @ linder

    I did like you ... and today I received 2 updates from Samsung, too

    :-)

    In my "perfect" world all the devices of a type should have the same os version, fw and functionalities

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @linder

    I personalyl have a sneaking suspicion that this is a way to get people to go into the stores and ask about tethering. I wonder if I went in with my Gen 1 Focus and said "can it tether" if AT&T would have a firmware upgrade ready to go (for the required $20/month of course!). Samsung (and MS) may have capitulated to the carriers on this one.

    Think about it, the iPhone supports tethering, but not without AT&T activation.

    It's entirely possible the older phones can't check for autherization on the account (like the newerphones clearly do) so they just put in a hard stop.

    Of course I'd have to go in and ask for a feature I don't want to pay for (and with the death of unlimited plans I don't think I should have to pay for!)

  • linder
    24 Posts

    Okay, we just bought several ChevronWP7 tokens to enable the built-in Mango tethering on our own.  We did not plan to unlock our Windows Phones, but there is no other way to handle it.  Thanks to Microsoft for supporting the Chevron guys.  I think this was a good move.

  • linder
    24 Posts

    @ScubaDog2011: Internet Sharing is really an essential feature for business users and Omnia 7 can handle it.  But for whatever strange reason, Samsung decided that "unbranded" phones do not get the latest firmware update to enable tethering yet (and perhaps never).  The carrier supports it, the phone supports it, and Mango supports it.

    So the only solution is to unlock the phone via the official ChevronWP7 and then deploy a hack to enable the built-in Mango tethering :-(

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @ ScubaDog2011

    Even then it's spotty at best.  My wife has a Focus S, (won at WPSTL, this is actually important just wait) we tried to turn on tethering to see what would happen (since the setting was there!) and it denied us since we aren't forking over the extra $20/month AT&T wants.  It looks like the OS doublechecks with the operator before allowing tethering.

  • LOL, @Rodney, we call it Northern Occupied Mexico around here.  And, @linder, I don't recall seeing any announcement that the Omnia 7 was going to get tethering.  In fact, unless OEMs & carriers deploy it separately, tethering isn't supported on legacy devices....only on most of the new ones.

  • linder
    24 Posts

    Okay, I am shocked. Connected my Omnia 7 (unbranded) with the computer and it reported that an update is available.  COOL!  It applied the latest Samsung firmware update and....

    Cool?  No, not cool at all.

    There is still no Internet Sharing; yes, NO tethering.  WHAT THE HELL???  Are these guys ever listening?  I lost all hopes....

    Back to my Apple iPhone 4s now.  This is so frustrating.

  • Hey Guys, pass this post along until someone does something about this Rev1.4 issue: www.windowsphonemetro.com/.../samsung-focus-rev-1-4-someone-needs-to-do-the-right-thing

  • Battery life really stinks on HTC Trophy.  Needs a fix.

  • This post is toast, been beat to death. On to the next posting.........................

  • @ ScubaDog2011

    I was going to say that you wouldn't have to worry about a place to stay. 8 hours west of Dallas? Man, you must be in New Texaco!

  • Actually, guys, @Rodney might be right (I'm not saying he IS right).  @Eric & Co. said that once the update was ready for Focus 1.4 owners there would be an expedited deployment.  So, it's not outside the realm of possibility that, for example, they get the "Eureka!" moment tomorrow and then trigger the deployment the next day or day after.  Since this only involved AT&T, whom I would hope are anxious to roll this out and be done with it, it's not unreasonable that the 10-day schedule is summarily abbreviated and this kicks by the weekend.  All this, of course, assumes that they ARE nearing that "Eureka!" moment.

  • @anw, I think you might be doing something wrong while trying to transfer your music.  I EASILY transferred all my music.  I was running a Windows Mobile device before moving to a smartphone, and a lot of my music on a card.  Once I installed Zune, though, I moved all my music from the card to Zune....piece of cake to add all that to the Library.  I then configured Zune to allow manual sync of media (since I share the library with my wife, who's running the iPhone 4).  I manually selected all the albums I wanted to sync, connected my Focus (which has the additional 32GB card in it) and let it fly.  Pretty soon all the music I wanted was on my phone.  No big deal.

  • @Rodney, you have no idea how badly I'd love to go to the Dallas event!  Unfortunately, that's an 8 hour drive to get to Dallas, and I've got play rehearsals going every night until the week before Christmas (I'm the director and in the starring role, so I can't get away with being absent, LOL).  Ugh, disappointing!

  • @ajm, please try the third partty app "Week Calendar".  It perfectly takes care of the weekly view capability.  I keep it pinned immediately below the native calendar.  The nice thing about the live tile on Week Calendar is that you can customize what you qualify as  a "week" and it will show you a graphic of the week.  Then, by clicking on the tile, you see the details for the week (or any week).

  • I have a Samsung Focus v1.4. Never have I more regretted a phone purchase.

    You'd think that you people, both at Microsoft and AT&T, would have figured out how to do this after the delay on the earlier patches, since now the problem should be, at least theoretically, well understood.

    Also, your customer service response on this issue has been very poor.

    Please make a post explaining this issue, why this issue is occurring, what time frame exists for this issue being corrected, and what you will be doing to, using the language of customer service, "make it good".

    One of the reasons I went with WP7 instead of Android was because I was leery about the inconsistency with which phones might or might not receive OS updates. Ironically, I ended up with a Focus 1.4, and now Google has been making very vocal efforts to make sure future devices will receive updates quickly and consistently. Now, please understand, I am not very wealthy, and my smartphone is one of a short list of luxury items I've been able to squeeze into my budget- and if I switch to another phone right now, it will be an even bigger blow to my budget, since I now have a 2 year contract with AT&T that I can't use to subsidize another phone on that service, and that I will have to cancel if I wish to go elsewhere. Nonetheless, switching to an iPhone 4S or an Android device has never looked so good, since I'm now filled with apprehension at the next WP7 phone I purchase (quite possibly in a desperate attempt to escape this issue on my current handset) having a similar problem which goes similarly all-but-unaddressed.

    Please reply in some form.

    Thank you.

  • @ tsrblke

    So is it possible that it could come this week?

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @mountain

    Scheduling normally takes 10 days.  The Focus 1.4s are such a small percentage of phones, it moved from "Scheduling" to "delivering in 1 or 2 days for NoDo, I expect the same for Mango.

  • enahs
    20 Posts

    @ajm

    Then why not just have ti billed to your phone account and pay for the apps when you pay the phone bill?

  • geogeek
    7 Posts

    Just sent an email to Brian and received a reply from him that there is nothing new.

  • @ mountain

    Yeah, that's the mood I've been talking about. You know those guys are horrible at updating the where's my update page. One time we had to ask them to update it after they made a announcement about update status. Its hard to rely one that list.

  • mountain
    18 Posts

    @Rodney If it is coming this week, the update should be in scheduling by now. Scheduling usually take 10 days according to MS. But who knows. They may do it in less time.

    my focus 1.4 is not complete without mango. mango was the much needed update that made WP more competitive and up to date. without mango I feel like I'm using a WP prototype . (no multitasking and all other goodies)

    compared to phones on other platforms, my focus 1.4 has inferior hardware, inferior apps with the inability to install most apps that require mango (ex: spotify) and now an incomplete OS that won't get updated.

    I am sure even Steve Ballmer would recommend Android or iPhone instead of WP at this point.

  • @ cm3763

    Right, Right..Sorry, just trying to find some light at the end of a long tunnel.

  • @ xerto73......"Yes. Yes I have." That's funny.

    You guy's got to realize that we all are upset about the late update to.

    First, it's just not fair that you guys don't get to enjoy it, which makes me feel guilty... Second, it causes fragmentation... Third, If it can happen to you will it happen to me later?.. Fourth, It disrupted our usually peaceful, and optimistic community, I mean we used to rag on Android and Apple, now we rag on WP!!!! Fifth, this could turn away new users, which we need for more reasons than one... Sixth, It's wasting time that Samsung and Microsoft could be using for getting us new S%#T... And there's probably many more negative effects. I hope I am right to. maybe a little good Karma on my part will help. That's all I can give.

  • cm3763
    37 Posts

    @rodney

    It does not work and will not work until they move it out of testing...

  • @ MCWOP

    That's a good point. Version 1.4 should have been tested before every other phone because of the NoDo incident. I would be pissed if I got hit with a late update twice. An That's been my point for a long time, if you are struggling to compete, not because the competition is better, but because they are only more established, then at lest make sure all hands are on deck and ready for the presentation.

    Can you try the Zune software trick now to see if the update ready??? I bet nobody's has tried it in a long time. Please let me know what Happens.

  • xerto73
    19 Posts

    @Rodney

    Yes. Yes I have. Thanks for noticing. This whole situation has pushed me to the breaking point.

    No not really, I just call it like I see it. I'm not the one that's going to be getting tons of flak if we sit through yet another week of nothing.

    Hope you're right.

  • MCWOP
    1 Posts

    Well I am a big iPad user, and had an Android and iPhone. Liked the metro UI, but only bought my focus knowing Mango was coming. Well nothing, and even this lame post with ZERO timeframe for release. MSFT is in no position to screw its customers, since it is badly losing the phone OS war. Well if Mnago is not here by thanksgiving for my focus v1.4, I am getting an iPhone 4S. At least Siri will give me answers, unlike MSFT. You guys have know about this phone version since NODO.

  • @ mountain ... I just got this feeling man, but if it doesn't happen please don't be mad at me.

    @ xerto73 ... Have you lost your mind?

    Only count on information from the horses mouth guys, But, sometimes I just have these "feelings" and when I listen to them they usually play out.

  • xerto73
    19 Posts

    @Rodney

    Comments like make you sound like you're trolling.

    What sources do you have for that tidbit of info?

  • mountain
    18 Posts

    @Rodney Where did you hear that 1.4 is getting mango this week?

  • I think a t shirt with the "pin" symbol on the front would be cool. :)

  • The version 1.4 update will come this week.

  • Sheeds
    205 Posts

    I will preface this by saying I <3 windows phone and that I empathise with all you Focus 1.4 owners out there :(

    What does iOS 5.0 have in common with Mango WP7.5?

    <scroll down>

    They BOTH won't install on a Samsung Focus H/ware version 1.4 :(

    Samsung and MS.....time to offer some FREE upgrades to FOcus Flash or discounted upgrade path to the Focus S guys!

  • I really hate to add yet another pessimistic note to the Focus 1.4 "Mango-gate" issue but having come from a corporate background and familiar with ongoing customer service issues to which there is no apparent answer, I suspect that someone with the lofty title of "General Manager, Customer Experience Engineering" wil not sink so low as to deal with the commoners directly. Rather, the "concerned comments" have been assigned as the weekly duty of an administrative assistant or staffer - hence the placating, non-substantive updates. After all, if you were the CEO of Microsoft would you pay a significant salary to any manager who addressed the public on a subject he was accountable for overseeing with a comment like "Hi everyone.  No news about updates this week" over and over again? I think not.

    In short fellow 1.4 owners, I suspect we are just keeping this controversy and issue alive amongst ourselves - I personally have not seen any Microsoft personnel interacting here and I read these comments daily. HOWEVER...

    Rebuttal to this theory is welcome "Eric", LOL, who knows, maybe cows will fly this week.

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @anw

    To be entirely fair, anytime you switch ecosystems there's a potential for some DRM to screw you over somewhere. My wife just swapped from the iPhone to the Windows phone, and guess what we have to repay for some of the apps she bought.  However, if she had gone in the opposite direction she'd have the same problem.  I'm just glad she doesn't have any DRM protected music. If the music on your memory card is some DRM protected mess, that may explain the problem (otherwise I don't understand what you mean, but we'd be happy to help.)

    As for the Bing 100 App, I can actually understand them not making it for WP7.  First it'd compete with Zune. Second, the point of it was probably to drive awareness and traffic to Bing, not so much a problem on a phone with Bing integration.

    Frankly I'm surprised AT&T forced a windows phone onto you, seeing as how they seem to actively try to discourage people from buying them. I'd probably not like my phone either (WP7, Android, or otherwise) if it wasn't want I wanted in the first place.

  • @ anw

    What phone did you want from AT&T in the first place?

  • anw
    1 Posts

    I've had my windows phone for almost a year now and I am not waiting for my upgrade through AT&T. I cannot stand this phone. The last time I updated my phone it took over an hour! With all of my previous phones I could swap out my memory cards...oh but that is a huge no no with the windows phone?! Are you serious? It's bad enough that I'm using up good free space on my computer for the Zune software (which I detest) but I can't use my old memory card and I haven't been able to download any apps similar to my old apps. For me it's the small simple things in life that bring me most pleasure. LIke, Bings Top 100s by year!!! Loved it! Had it on my EVO and it was FREE but oh no can't have it on the Windows phone. WTH?! And I can't transfer the music downloaded from my memory card to my phone, Zune doesn't allow it. Well it's a good darn thing that I didn't subscribe to Zune. I have to put up with crap but I am in no mood to be told by another pain in my side miscrosoft software that I can't transfer my own media to my own phone. I REFUSE to pay for something I already have!!!!. I think that AT&T just adds fuel to my fireball of frustration with this stupid phone. To be quite honest I only got the Windows phone because AT&T gave it to me for free because they didn't have the phone I wanted in store. That should've told me something right then and there. Microsoft, I'm going to have to let you go. You will no longer be getting anymore of my hard earned money EVER!!!!!

  • Also, has anyone with version 1.4 tried the Zune software update trick LATELY? Who knows it might be in there right now as we speak. They just might be waiting to send the message to your phones. Will someone try it and please and post what happens?

  • Version 1.4 owners

    I think they are having a issue with data transmiting or reception with your devices and the update The posting of Brian's email could have been a way to get radon devices to transmit data to MS/Samsung so they could get needed data to test the update. This may be a sign that the update is coming. Trying to contact Brian is a waste because they already said the updates still in the works and that's the only possible answer you could get now anyways. The update will only be available when they say it is, just like they have done with every update. Again, this is just speculation on my part.

  • Is MS's idea of customer support having someone in their company randomly post a vague 'email me' on a blog so that users can then be offered some unofficial swap of their merchandise? Weird stuff. There should be an official policy on this piece of defective equipment (v1.4). I don't care if it is Microsoft or Samsung, but both should offer the necessary info to get it taken care of. Microsoft certainly has the most to lose here as this is their platform and the frustrated users on this blog are their best marketers (especially given customers' reports of the in store experience). Hey Eric, aren't you a 'Customer Experience Engineer'? Surely you can do better than once weekly blog post saying 'no news'.

  • xerto73
    19 Posts

    PS I did copy and paste that email address into OneNote before they could remove it again ;)

  • xerto73
    19 Posts

    @Gooch seems shady to me. Why is it they are not offering a "working focus" to the rest of us? This whole situation is full of conspiracy theories, if you will.

    If you are not going to update the 1.4s then we should all be receiving this deal. I know that I cannot afford to buy another phone out of contract and I shouldn't have to since I was told that my rev of the Samsung Focus would get the Mango update with no problems.

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @Gooch

    We know he's doing a lot of traveling for this show, I'd give him at least a fair break on that (Rather than moaning and complaining he's going to do you a huge favor.) I know from past experience, Brian's a man of his word.

  • Gooch
    2 Posts

    I contacted Brian Seitz after I saw he posted his email address in the comments on one of the blog posts (looks like it's since been removed) telling a couple of people to contact him regarding the v1.4. Definitely got my hopes up. Now that I've been ignored again, I have no qualms with posting this here. I told him I was switching back to iPhone this weekend, but before I dropped money on an out-of-contract iPhone, I asked if he had any info on the v1.4. Almost immediately I got a reply back saying, "Hey *my real name*. Can I send you a working focus?" I responded that that would be awesome. That I really like WP7. I then asked what info he needed from me. It's been 3 days, and I haven't heard anything back since. I'm getting a 4S tomorrow.  You guys might want to contact him too, maybe you'll have better luck than I did. <bseitz@microsoft.com>

  • I would gladly check out other word games.....if all of my friends and family would as well. As it stands, my mother in law, wife and almost every Facebook friend plays Words With Friends. Especially now that its on Facebook. Again, I would love to try out new games. However, its one of those things were a huge user base and sort of comfort level has been established..

  • Krush You
    94 Posts

    @tony - you should check out words by post - its available for all platforms and you can play against iPhone, android and windows users.

  • Just to lighten the mood a bit....can MS hurry up and get Words With Friends on board? Granted, I have the game on my iPod. But I carry my Focus everywhere. So it would make it much more convenient :)

  • I just saw a WindowsPhone commercial for the HTC Radar, here in Dallas. It's sad that this is news, but I'm glad to see it on tv. I also heard about the Mango food truck in New York going to ATT stores. Keep it coming boys!

    @ scuba...Are you going to the Dallas party?

  • mountain
    18 Posts

    @ thrashee Exactly. No wonder Apple is so appealing to many. They do things right. This is why MS always lose the game and end up with dead projects.

    @ xerto73 Well the silent treatment is definitely not working out for them. Bad communication always leads to problems.

    also please vote for this: windowsphone.uservoice.com/.../2377028-where-is-mango-samsung-for-focus-1-4

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    So my wife loved the focus S enough that she decided to go in and have her iPhone SIM swapped for the WP7.  The Guy at AT&T actually told her to stick with the iPhone.  Let's be clear here, we had the phone in our hand (since we owned it already), he didn't have to sell us anything, we didn't ask for his opinion, we said "Turn this on for us" and he felt the need to tell us "Mango wasn't impressive, you'll regret this."

    MS, you have a problem.  Get AT&T in line, or you're screwed, that's that.  I had to show the rep flipping live tiles (on my Original Focus).

    Maybe he had a Focus 1.4, who knows.  Either way, bad form, and bad news.

  • xerto73
    19 Posts

    Didn't know the silent treatment was an official corporate stance that needed to be taken whenever faced with a group of customers who have doggedly stuck by you and who are now tired of getting nothing in return for their patronage.

    My customer experience has been crap by the way.  Why don't you focus on it a little more.

  • @ mountain,

    I drew a line in the sand and decided when my upgrade cycle came around that if Mango didn't address the separate volume control issue that should have been included since day 1, I'd go back to the iPhone. I gave an entire list of things in this blog that Mango needed to include and Mr. Stroh responded with "I LOVE your ideas and will make sure they get communicated", but, not surprisingly, Mango didn't include them. So back to the iPhone I went.

    I'll tell you--I do miss the Metro UI but I absolutely love having a mature phone that I don't have to keep giving slack because it didn't have this or that or the other. I'm not paying my hard earned money to give something a chance when a year later we're expected to keep on having patience and keep on giving the benefit of the doubt.

    And you know what the best part is? I just upgraded iOS today and I didn't need to consult a chart with vague time lines marked by a slew of asterisks to get it.

  • mountain
    18 Posts

    @ Otaku83 Me too. I am strongly considering getting an Iphone. Spotify was released on WP and I can't even install the app because My focus 1.4 doesn't have mango. I sometimes ask my self why I ever bought a WP. I guess I just had faith. And I was wrong. Microsoft, you keep spending money on marketing (building the largest WP phone) but your time is better spent by dedicating your your resources on the current customers.

    I am probably not going to wait much longer. Just remember that you are just losing your "original" customers that jump started your platform.

  • Otaku83
    3 Posts

    I recently went into Best Buy to trade in my old BB, and three of the associates in the wireless department had Windows Phones.  One had the Sprint one, the other two had HD7s on TMobile.  All three were very enthusiastic about Mango.  When I mentioned that I didn't have Mango, they all seemed shocked that I hadn't updated yet.  I explained about the Focus 1.4 issue, and none had even heard of it.  When I finally convinced them of the update issue, they expressed sympathy, but one girl responded along the lines of "if they screw up updates for my phone, I'm going right back to the iPhone".  This tells me that people absolutely LOVE their Mango phones.  (One girl even said that.)  But Microsoft is one step away from losing all these converts if they cannot keep their head in the game.  Microsoft (and the handset manufacturers) need to be examining every little thing to make sure this sort of debacle doesn't happen again.    All I know is that unless I can get an awesome WP experience when it's time to renew my contract, I'm going to jump ship.  It's up to you, MS...

  • purevibz
    14 Posts

    guess what.... I went into att today and they put the phone all the way in the back of the storewith screens off sitting beside the iPhone 3gs and iPhone 4 with the iPhone 4 screen on showing the phones features I had to turn on the phones adjust the screen brightness to high on all phone and the time out to 5 mins, then put one on xbox and the others on picture and people, but here's the problem microsoft needs to make sure that all demo phones have a active account for the people hub so that customers can see how the people hub works because you can't tell by just looking at the phone, when you look at the new vivid android phone the HTC copy of te people hub show you live people pictures but when you turn on the focus S all you see is set up a account.... so please get someone out there to the stores and make sure we get this corrected. also the store HD7S phone would not even turn on, this is bad I know microsoft can do better.

  • @ nickhill

    Welcome to the blog Nickhill, and thanks for the optimism.

  • purevibz
    14 Posts

    the problem is that we're the true evangelist out here in the field and when we cant show new features of the phone and update we look like idiots and you get hit with ...how is this different from android? You would think that after nodo we would have this taken care of and the fact that we have to cry for you all to finally answer is disheartening.

  • <a href="http://www.1smartphone.ru">IOS. Android. Symbian. Windows Phone. Все операционные системы для смартфонов и коммуникаторов.</a>

  • mountain
    18 Posts

    @ williamsjm I agree with you. Microsoft needs more control over their devices. This way, There won't be any hardware surprises when it comes to updating. Microsoft should ask the manufactures to let them evaluate the phone thoroughly before putting it on the market. This way every phone will be able get the updates in the same time period.

  • I recently exchanged my Focus under warranty and went from a wonderful 7.5 phone to a cruddy 7.0 phone that I can't update!  What a bunch of crap. I really dislike having to use 7.0.  Had I known there would be an issue upgrading I would have kept the "broken" phone.

    So who do I blame?  ATT?  Samsung?  Microsoft?

    You can say what you want about Apple but at least there's a single choke-point.  When problems arise with Apple you don't get the run-around, finger-pointing BS you get with Microsoft.  The carriers kiss Apples ass; people line up down the block and around the corner to buy those miserable iPhones.  No - Apple isn't perfect; I hate Apple, but the BS with Microsoft is endless and insane and avoidable.

    In the end I guess I blame myself.  Fooled again.  Yes I'm bitter.

  • ajm
    3 Posts

    It's great to keep the users informed, so thanks.  I don't know where else to get in touch with people with influence at Microsoft, so I'm digressing going to put a few off topic ideas out here for you.

    I gather from much searching all over the net, that my unlocked LG Quantum, on Telus in Canada may or may not get the update to allow wifi tethering and that, although Telus allows tethering, it may be the responsibility of LG to provide the update. I've wasted many hours trying to figure this out and I'm still not sure that I have it right.  I think Microsoft should be able to use their power to ensure all phones to get such updates.  I expect my WP to make my life more efficient, not to have me wasting time managing the phone itself.  Although the flow of info seems to be improving, there's still room for improvement.  I should be able to find the answer to my questions at an easily searchable website, and though it may be a lot of work, Microsoft should be able to let me know what to expect for my specific phone regarding all updates.  No matter what the manufacturer or carrier is, the constant is Microsoft in the public's eyes and confusion with one brand or  model will effect the confidence in the brand as a whole.

    I couldn't get my teens interested in WP7.5, regardless of the tie ins with our xBox, because they don't have creditcards to buy apps, and their xBox Live points can't be used.  How can I argue with them, when they can buy iTunes gift cards for their ipod touches, without ever risking anyone's credit card security.  They'd rather have an iphone for that reason alone.  I, too,  want to buy apps, but refuse because I won't risk my creditcard.  I believe the success of marketplace and profits for your developers should  be considered mandatory for the survival of this platform.

    Please make WP7.5 Word more powerful from an editing/viewing perspective.  I find all the emphasis on cloud-type features to be annoying.  When I first started up Word, expecting something fabulous, in keeping with the year 2012, I was shocked to find that as far as editing goes, it's little more than a way to enter text into a Word format document.  It's not designed for the user to actually create a more or less finished document on the phone.  When I'm writing a Word doc at an airport, etc.. to send out to a client in a rush, there's no way to preview the doc in a page view, to see how it will appear to the client.  Automatic wordwrap limits the ability to zoom out and see the layout.  Of course, there's little control over fonts and font sizes either.  I've received travel memos, etc. which I've been unable to read due to this automatic wordwrap. (phone numbers, names, and flight numbers are impossible to connect to each other once they're wordwapped to death)

    The Calendar has some infuriating peculiarities.  The live tile takes up a lot of space, but I find no controls for what is in that space.  It seems to only show appointments for the current or next day.   I always want to see what's next in my agenda, no matter how far off it is.  There's no week display and the month view is ugly and unreadable as far as appointments go. It reminds me of something from an old commodore 64 or something.  I can see faint little bits of writing where appointments are, but honestly, I was shocked when I first started using it.

    I've listed these things because I want WP7 to succeed.  I may sound sound negative, but I actually love using my Windows phone.  I just know that it is a few frustratingly small steps away from true greatness.  Help us to brag about our phones to those who are unfamiliar with them.

  • mountain
    18 Posts

    IF you own a focus 1.4 vote here:

    windowsphone.uservoice.com/.../2377028-where-is-mango-samsung-for-focus-1-4

    Even if your not, please vote. Thanks.

  • blaksnar
    23 Posts

    @tsrblke Again, it's a misconception that they have only 2 carriers. They do updates worldwide and iPhones are sold by many carriers across the world. Definitely more than WP. But they own their devices and so no need to work with multiple partners on testing and bug fixes.

  • tsrblke
    327 Posts

    @blaksnar

    I think it's a misconception that apple bypasses carrier testing.  They only have 2 carriers to test with and a few devices to test.  It's likely they just don't announce anything until it's already completed testing.  Notice that the official dates for release of any iOS are only given a few weeks before it happens.  It's just better PR management. (Not that WP couldn't use some of that reality distortion field right now!)

    Meanwhile, my wife is giving the Focus S a try over her iPhone.  Her initial concers are all strange from my perspective (She doesn't like the white on black text but doesn't like having to have white on the start screen either.)  I'll let you know how that turns out.

  • blaksnar
    23 Posts

    Also the most important question which has been bugging me for some time - Why that Apple can bypass the carrier testing and directly deliver to customer meanwhile Microsoft cannot?

    Apple delivered the iOS 5.01 update through iTunes on a single day worldwide to 5 devices. On a single day!!!!

    The system of updates through carrier is absolutely broken and that's the reason Android is suffering. I see the same problem with WP too. The best decision Microsoft could take is bypassing carriers for long term benefit instead of bending over to carriers like AT&T.

  • Fjtorsol
    18 Posts

    Definetly MS is not taking WP7 seriously it's obvious that the carrier testing system doesn't work at any point just think of other ways as most of carriers aren't sufficiently equiped to do a useful testing process (as an obvious example Telefonica Spain). And if something it's not working don't stop everything (I.E.: previous MS apps & games update to mango, teethering updates for unlocked devices, skype application, an MS copass application as theorically all WP7 handsets have this built-in sensor to make use of it) with the resources MS has and a PROPER MANAGEMENT this issues can be easily adressed simultaneously in a very short period if time. Considering the effort is taking for MS to manage this tiny marketshare how they intend to expand it more widely without a better management???

  • www.bell.ca  I only wish I could actually own a Windows Phone so that I could wait for the update!  Nevermind the update, when can Canada expect some of the phones!  Microsoft and OEMs really need to advertise more, its nice that there is a big phone in NYC, but at least start spreading rumors as to when Canada will see the new phones.   The carrier I use doesnt even offer a Windows Phone and I have been waiting patiently for 2 months

  • linder
    24 Posts

    This is so frustrating. Just connected my iPhone 4s with the PC and it said: "A new iPhone software version (5.0.1) is available for the iPhone "XYZ".  Would you like to download it and update your iPhone now"?

    A colleague with an iPhone 3GS and my niece with an iPod touch (4t gen.) received the same message.  That's how it should work.  And two of our Omnia 7 (non-branded) company phones are still on WP7 with no Mango update notification available.  Argh!  But to be on the safe side, I'll check again for the Mango updates after I have updated my iPhone... <g>

  • Oh, allow me to point just a few small things out....

    First and foremost, thank you Eric  & everyone from MS who's been writing on this blog, keeping us WP fans updated. You guys deserve a 'thank you'. We fans/customers have ranted and raved on these blogs and none of us have been kicked out! (so far :P)

    Second, I personally have complained a couple of times about the lack of marketing. I'm not (yet) a customer of WP, but want to be one. Now, maybe we could all do more individually to get the word out about how cool WP is. I'm sure a lot of us are doing it already, but it's just a suggestion. Instead of complaining, this might just help us start our own friends comprised community of WP users.

    @Rodney - Don't want to pick any issues/fights with you or anything, but the blog's tone seems neutral, even a bit positive. It is the comments we have added that makes it negative & depressing. Let's take a long breather  (six months?) and see if these 'issues' are ironed out by subsequent releases. Any new shoe initially pinches. Maybe once porcesses/implementations smooth out we'll see the best of WP.

    #optimist :)

  • Nice post. No offense, but why are you part of the 'Customer Experience Engineering' group?

  • vieya
    44 Posts

    Will there be any new windows phones going to sprint? We have 1 and that's about it. I'm looking forward to the Nokia but I'm sure that will probbaly go to At&t or t-mobile plus it has no front facing camera. Why the lack of CDMA phones? I heard it was because of no support for 4G LTE...is that true? I just wish sprint would have as many options as At&t or even T-mobile. We basically have 1 choice for windows phone.

  • Conny
    60 Posts

    @Rodney, and get attached to Android? Never. I do like the fact that I haven't come across a single video yet that wouldn't play though.

    Like I said, I have until the end of the month to change my mind.

    Microsoft, you have my email address. Here's a challenge for you: change my mind for me!!

  • Conny
    60 Posts

    @Rodney, I've seriously been considering it  however lte is still quite a bit in the future for my town  and by the time we get it, Windows lte Phones will hopefully be available.

    Personally, and this should clear up why I bought a new phone months after getting my Focus, is that I'm a tech addict. I love buying new phones especially, and thankfully have three lines available to me that I can upgrade. One of the reasons for me personally was the fact that when I purchased my refurbished Sammy, I had no idea that there where two versions. When I found out a short while later, I immediately checked under my battery, paying I had a 1.3.

    I upgraded to mango the day of release, by cutting in line. I read every available tech blog, and what bothers me a lot is how little the 1.4 owners are even acknowledged. Not just here, but everywhere. It simply is time for MS and Sammy to admit that something is wrong.

    It's time for either MS or Sammy to take the reigns and fix it, either by upgrading 1.4 owners to the Focus S (I'm looking at you Sammy) or by sending out vouchers for up to x amount toward a new phone (ya know, up to 200.- Microsoft).

    WP and Metro are the future of phones, the next iPhone. But several things that are still severely lacking need to be addressed first before its true potential is reached. Advertisements, training for carrier sales reps are the two most obvious.

    This blog is all well and good, but how many WP owners actually come here? I may not post as much as scuba, Rodney or tsrblke, but I'm here all the time. Even now..lol.. We may be somewhat informed, but I bet the majority is not.

    When I went to get my new phone, I asked my sales rep about the new phones, as I always do. In no time I was spouting off specs, and several reps admitted that they neither new as much about these phones, not when they were going to hit their shelves. they had less then a week, and knew absolutely nothing. But every single one could tell me about the Vivid and Skyrocket.

    I'm still horribly tempted to go back and exchange this phone for the Titan or Focus S, but who here from Microsoft can give me some sort of guarantee that I won't regret it?

  • HTC
    14 Posts

    A reminder for everyone that if your device has a manufacturing defect it should be covered by warranty.  In most jurisdictions this protects the consumer from being abandoned from support.  Not being able to update due to some error(s) that the OEM and or the OEM's operating system vendor have created is a defect.  Take your phone to the service centre and tell them to a) fix it; or if they are unwilling or unable to fix it then b) replace it with an equivalent non-defective product; or c) refund or compensate the purchase cost.

    To be honest Microsoft is mishandling this.  They should be offering every user of devices that cannot update to swap their device for a new one (creates goodwill) providing the existing device is working normally under pre-Mango state, then fix the swapped-in devices once the fix is available and use these for testing, development, loan, refurbished free gifts for employees' families, etc.  It's just good business to keep your customers happy while minimising the cost of doing so.

  • @ scuba

    4g LTE is up and working great here in Dallas Fort Worth. This is a huge market, and I could get a Samsung Skyrocket and be enjoying speeds up to or morethan more than 15mbs. Remember, it's not what I think should be or what interest you, but what the majority wants, for whatever reason. That's how you stay competive. I realize that as soon as the WP community stops just trying to defy everything, and we be less prideful, then we will see better devices.

  • Oh, goodness, @Rodney, that all sounds good, except so-called 4G or LTE is hardly deployed anywhere.  I live in west Texas.  We just got 3G and it's spotty at best.  We probably won't see 4G for 2-3 years.  So, why on earth should I get excited over getting phones that have a capability I will never use?  I'd rather focus on features I can actually take advantage of.  Not everyone lives in a megalopolis, which is where the faster networds are deployed.  Most of us live in the real world, LOL.

  • @ mountain

    Exactly! "We gave WP a chance while there are other options" So true. Ya know, it's not that I'm panicking over here. I love WP. I just want to secure the idea that in the future WP will be more competitive. One day I will be looking for a new device and I don't want to choose WP because of loyalty, but because I'm getting a state of the art device, that's worth the price. Also, I don't want this update fiasco to affect me the next time around. I can deal with the wait, it's the secretive, government BS style of communication that would tic me off.

  • mountain
    18 Posts

    @ Rodney

    I couldn't agree more. This blog shows that MS is horrible at handling situations like this. When will they understand? The less the customers know, the more irritated they get. Samsung and ATT have been quiet about this (no surprise) but Microsoft should step up and take care of this themselves. Let your customers know what's going on. It seems as if MS does not even care much at this point. I own a focus 1.4 and it is frustrating to know that we have been left behind.

    We gave WP a chance when there are other options. Don't forget that!

  • @ Connie

    The reason why I agree with your decision is because you are the one who worked hard for your money. You had to make the most logical and cost effective decision towards buying a new phone. You are a adult and have the right to buy a device based on hardware, OS, timing, color or whatever. I was in att yesterday and did see how hard it would be for a salesperson to suggest a device with less features, or lower specs that isn't priced competively. I hope that WP can move into the high end smartphone arena before you get to attached to Android.

    By the way, yesterday the Galaxy skyrocket was running LTE at 15 mbs, according to the speedtest.net app, which WP still doesn't have. And, the new HTC device has a QHD display and a true 16/9 aspect ratio. These two devices are only $50 more than the Focus S, and you can have LTE now not whenever WP gets it later next year. Connie, you should return your phone and get one of these, for now.

    I want to be winner, don't you guys?

  • !!  @ Microsoft  !!

    This is the most depressing blog so far!

    Something needs to be fix quick. I could understand how someone looking in at this blog would be turned away instantly from WP. Almost every comment is negative. Users are crying out this week in a big way, and in to many ways, about to many issues. These weeks are supposed to be WP at it's best. The launch at ATT made zero impact, infact it hurt our reputation in a way. The two Android devices launched the same day as the Focus's and demolished them. The only way to sell the FS is to lower the price, and it's only the first week. Users are jumping ship and moral is low, low, low! Although it may not be the case in some peoples opinion others feel this launch has been another failure, and not to mention the update issues.

    We need some feedback from you guys letting us know that you are aware of all the issues that are concerning users. No less than a promise that the future of Windows Phone will be what we expect will do.

    Once again, if I was someone looking to buy a smartphone, and came across this blog, I would knock WP off my list permanently! I can't believe that it's only been one year and people are already switching to other platforms. If WP can't hold onto users, and has the lowest market share, does that mean we are winning or loosing? To be honest, it really seems like a simple fix. I am a small business owner and if I can keep my customers coming back year after year, with less than .01% of your resources, then I expect more from WP. Wow the customer and they will stay loyal and bring you more clients. Might I add that I do not have a business degree, but I have learned that greed always gets in the way of logical thinking.

    No mater how anybody tries to justify, or adjust the situation, the words I wrote above are the reality, and current state of the WP community.

    It shattered me to hear that Connie "moved on" to a Andriod device. What is going to change? Also, I speek for everyone when I say that someone from MS needs to reply directly to this comment by tomorrow.

    Users who agree, please comment with "MS please respond with the state of WP" or use a # followed by this reply in Twitter.

  • There are more comments about this post than the big NYC launch event. Clearly, this is a significant issue for Windows Phone's most vocal supporters yet it remains unresolved and v1.4 owners are just as much in the dark. It really doesn't matter if we're talking about Microsoft, or Samsung, or ATT... all companies should be concerned (and in my opinion, particularly Microsoft) that the initial base of customers (a small but dedicated group) is already growing dissatisfied. You won't win over the public at large without other users promoting the phone to others. This is a distraction from what should be us users helping to promote the new phones and the mango launch.

  • mountain
    18 Posts

    Why do we (1.4 owners) have to suffer from Samsung's mistakes???? Either recall 1.4 or offer trade-ins. We CANNOT stand these delays anymore.

    At least give us a date so we know when we can expect the update. Sounds to me like 1.4 update won't be here until December. And I won't be here either.

  • Zerofun
    13 Posts

    AT&T and Samsung should let the people with the 1.4 that have recently bought it and are on a 2 year contract, exchange it for a focus S with a minimal up charge. Just an option.. hell i would even renew my 2 year contract.. but some kind of option for the people that are into the phone updates, and upset.. Olive branch.. this is were apple shines.. every time i  had an issue with apple.. it was taken care of, i even got an early upgrade when the 3Gs came out shortly after my purchase of the 3G.. Metro is WIN, lets just get the hardware and support to back it up please.

  • xerto73
    19 Posts

    I really don't care who's fault it is. Enough with the finger pointing. I want it fixed and i want it fixed now. All of these companies have had ample time to work on this problem.  There is absolutely no reason this should not have been fixed.

    Many of us check the blog everyday to see if there's any new info. We get no responses from inquiries and recently these brief updates (more like shut up and wait) only mention the Focus 1.4 with passing innuendos.

    It doesn't feel good when you're excluded from all the fun you see every one else having. Everytime i see an article about how great mango is i regret buying this phone.

  • @ ScubaDog,

    I'm not sure what, exactly, you're disagreeing with. I never said squat about "big, bad corporations". I said ultimately--in the eyes of consumers--it IS Microsoft's fault. That's a fact. You already acknowledged this much when you vocalized your frustration that everyone tends to blame Microsoft for Samsung or carrier issues. And can you really blame them? Back when I had my Focus and the NoDo fiasco was going on, I called AT&T. I called Samsung. I called Microsoft. All to find out where the hell the update was. And I got the run-around and finger-pointing from every single one of them. The truth is, consumers don't care WHO is at fault, they just want SOMEONE from this partnership to take responsibility and provide answers. And all 3 of them failed.

    Shout all you'd like. At the end of the day, this is Microsoft's product, not Samsung's and not the carriers. That's why Microsoft is hosting these silly launch events with dancing zombies and "impromptu" marriage proposals instead of AT&T and Samsung. At the end of the day, it won't matter who was to blame when the consumer, like me, says to hell with it and chooses Android or Apple instead.

  • blaksnar
    23 Posts

    @ ScubaDog Microsoft didn't know that there was a v1.4 Focus phone on large not now but 8 months before. Are you even going to support MS with saying that they were not able to work with Samsung on issues for v1.4 phones for past 8 months?

    And they glossed over the issue during the NoDo update saying that the memory module was the only difference between 1.3 and 1.4 and they were caught off guard at that time. Everyone believed then and gave MS a chance. Not again. I honestly believe the hardware issues on v1.4 are deeper than it was communicated and Microsoft does not have enough clout (at mobile marketfield) to put the blame on it's much needed partner Samsung.

    Also, ATT has a fair share of blame here if we believe what's floating around the web. Some here and other forums has mentioned that unbranded Focus v1.4 phones (not sure even they exist outside ATT) already recieved the Mango update. If so, Microsoft and Samsung have nothing to do with the problem but ATT. Again with an assumption, as Microsoft is dependent on ATT and not the other way, they are not able to really push ATT on testing and delivering the update.

  • And, as a follow-up to my question about email issues, I cleared it up.  Methinks that spam-handling in Hotmail isn't quite where they need it to be, because I apparently had an email come in that choked my account on the server.  I had to go online and delete some garbage before the floodgates finally opened.  I truly hate spam.  And hackers.  And snow.  But I digress.

  • Then, @Thrashee, I insist that you are dead wrong.  Complain all you want.  But I insist you are wrong.  I get quite angry at people like you, tending to ascribe evil motives to the "big, bad corporations".  I actually DO think this was a massive communication problem (something that I think has been indemic to Microsoft for some time, as well as AT&T and Samsung).  I have no problem believing that Samsung probably thought "this is not really a substantive change to the device, and our direct-load of WP7 worked fine, so let's just start sending these things out".  This happens in industry all the time.  Heck, we sent a multi-million dollar probe to Mars which ultimately got lost or crashed because the European team built parts of the probe and coded it in metric while our parts were built and coded in imperial standard.  You'd think that a LOT more care would have been taken in the communication piece, wouldn't you?  So, it's not surprising that something similar might have happened here.  So, I'll stand right up to your face and shout you down on this issue.  I'm sorry, but this is one of my soapboxes.  Now, where I WILL back you up is in pushing Microsoft to be a LOT more helpful in providing details, details, details on what's actually going on (as I posted earlier in this thread).  But I believe it's intellectually dishonest to make Microsoft the lone scapegoat in this one.  That's all I'm going to say on the matter, since I know you are going to be as immovable as me on this.

  • Unfortunately, @linder, you are running into the same frustration I normally do in dealing with AT&T.  Samsung has to work the issue at the device level and then work with AT&T to figure out exactly how it would be deployed.  Some things can come out as simply a "Samsung Zone" app, but others need to go out as an actual firmware update.  If we think getting a complete answer out of Microsoft is difficult, try doing it with AT&T or Samsung.  They will almost always (moreso AT&T) simply respond with "you have the latest available updates on your device".  Technically true, of course, but they're using word tense to avoid answering the real question.  That's that love/hate I have with AT&T.  I've had nothing but great service as far as actually using their network.  I don't live in NY or San Fancisco, so I don't run into the issues they do.  But heaven forbid any problems pop up!  At that point it's a black hole.